Home Forums Gamescan Chat42 About
* Login   * Register * FAQ    * Search
It is currently Thu 03-28-2024 1:29PM

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: computer speakers in case
PostPosted: Tue 07-13-2004 9:28PM 
Offline
Major
User avatar

Joined: Thu 09-04-2003 2:17PM
Posts: 392

Source: VPN
i'm moding a case and would like to install speakers into the case. not one of those pc speakers that gives you the POST beep, but like 3" car speakers or some dismantled computer speakers. the problem with that is that if i use car speakers they won't be powered very much. i suppose i could take appart some computer speakers but i don't wanna spend that money. you guys have any suggestions?


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue 07-13-2004 10:10PM 
Offline
Captain
User avatar

Joined: Wed 10-23-2002 10:40AM
Posts: 178

Source: Fidelity
I can see two problems with speakers built into a PC case:

1) Magnetic field from speakers could cause strange things to happen to the PC

2) A case is very far from an acceptable speaker enclosure. Vibration, resonance and other bad things will happen.

Is there a specific reason to put speakers in a case?

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue 07-13-2004 10:50PM 
Offline
Colonel
User avatar

Joined: Sun 08-18-2002 10:33AM
Posts: 750
Location: Kansas City, KS

Source: Off Campus
I've seen 5-1/4" bay speaker sets. Probably sound pretty tinny, but they do come pre-made.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 1:50AM 
Offline
Major General
User avatar

Joined: Sat 10-18-2003 10:26PM
Posts: 2954
Location: Stone's throw from Garden of the Gods, Colorado Springs

Source: Christian Campus House
Finally! Something I can comment on...

One of my favorite hobbies is designing audio systems. Working with computer hardware is also fun...so why not throw the two together?? Here are a few things that came to mind for me when I read this...warning, this is going to be a novel, but I hope this helps you out.

Ok. This all depends on what you want your speaker setup to do. (I'm going to assume that you're using a full- or mid-tower case.) Do you want these speakers in primarily for show? Do you want to use these speakers as your main audio channels? Or do you want to have these as kind of an auxiliary setup, something to use when you're on the road (or a LAN party or wherever)? Also, do you want to game, play music, watch movies, or listen to Windows perform its sound effects?

The latter is going to be about as good as you're going to get if you just cut a couple holes in your case and wire up some speakers.

Don't get discouraged, because there is some good news at the end. But for now I present you with A few things to consider:

-->A 3" car speaker is, simply put, a tweeter. Basically, it's only going to be efficient when it's pumping out anything above 5-6 kHz--which would be a good component addition, but by themselves, are way too tinny and NOT what you want for your main speaker. Some cheap, decent 2-way speakers can be had in the 4" size; this'll add quite a bit of audio versatility to your setup, and you'll be better able to handle high and low notes simultaneously; however, you've got this little issue of space. I'm pretty confident that you're not going to be satisfied with anything less than a 4" speaker.

-->You're going to want to put these speakers in an enclosure. Speakers work by moving and compressing air. For this to work effectively, the air the speaker's moving and compressing needs to be fairly stagnant--which, if you've got a decent computer setup, had better not be the case. You computer components need air to stay cool and work effectively; for your speakers to work effectively, they need to be in an enclosure. I'm thinking thin plywood, sheet metal, or perhaps a quality plastic fab job; at the very least, you could use speaker baffles. Basically, something to keep the air in, and make the speaker more punchy.

-->The enclosure should also take care of some of the magnetic shielding--not only from the interference that the speaker magnets will have on your computer internals, but the much more noticable interference that a high-EM environment such as the inside of your computer will have on your speaker, amp, and signal wire. Speaking of which...

-->This application requires a speaker amplifier. A typical Sound Blaster 32 puts out 1.8 watts at 4 ohms from its amped output--just enough for a set of headphones. Your most efficient 2-way 4" speakers are rated 20 watts RMS, per channel. If you connect these speakers directly to the board, your sound output will be very faint, if it in fact even exists. You also risk overdrawing power on your sound card, frying it and potentially the motherboard. You WILL need an in-case amplifier. You can find a DC amplifier (or rip one from a set of computer speakers) that you can wire to run off the computer's power supply. Keep in mind, however, that this is one more signal-critical component that will be exposed to high EM interference, introducing feedback noise and annoying whine & hiss into your setup.

-->Especially if you want to use these speakers for movies or gaming, you will want to keep direction and separation in mind when you're trying to figure out how to mount your speakers in the case. With the size of speakers you're going to be using, sound direction is going to depend greatly on what direction your speakers are going to be firing. (Obviously this wouldn't be the case with a subwoofer.) Also, you want your speakers a good distance apart so your ears can discriminate between left and right speaker channels (if you're a 3d gamer, you understand how vital this is). Keep in mind that since the distance between your mounting locations (i.e., the width of your case) is small, you can't achieve a very wide speaker separation, and therefore directionality and stereo separation are mutually exclusive. You can't have both (the way you could if you simply set two satellite speakers on opposite corners of your desk and pointed them toward you), so you have to make a trade-off. For instance, if you mount the speakers in the front panel of the case, both speakers will point toward you (so you get the full directional effect), but you will achieve minimum stereo separation because sound originates from practically the same spot. However, if you mount your speakers into the sides of the case, firing out left and right, you achieve decent stereo separation, but your directionality is all gone--you won't hear the highest notes because they're traveling to left and right of you, and not directly to you. (Not to mention that unless you're very lucky or have an oversize case, the mounting depth of one of your speakers is going to interfere with the position of the motherboard.)

So, if I haven't scared you away from this project now that I've told you all the reasons you don't want to do this (or at least several of the problems you'll run into), wanna hear the good news?

I think you've got a cool idea going, and I think with a little thought and refining, you can make this work and become something really cool. I've got a few ideas as far as mounting the speakers in your case, what would work and how you could do it--but I'd have to check out your case to see what indeed you can do. If you wouldn't mind having a partner to work on the project, I'd be interested, or even if you want to do this by yourself and are just trying to figure out where to start--shoot me a PM and we can kick some ideas around.

_________________
It's still UMR to me, dammit.


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 2:07AM 
Offline
Pointless Post Specialist
User avatar

Joined: Mon 04-21-2003 2:54PM
Posts: 1826
Location: KC

Source: Off Campus
I have a pair of polk 2 ways for sale.

4" polkaudio ex340's

they fit my old car.....but are too tiny for the one I have now. They sounded great though. It does have a pointable tweeter if that's important for you.

_________________
Aw man, I shot Marvin in the Face!


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 6:26AM 
Offline
Captain
User avatar

Joined: Wed 10-23-2002 10:40AM
Posts: 178

Source: Fidelity
*** OT ****
bagvwf, its nice to see someone that understands speaker design. I an currently designing my first pair of speakers and crossover. I'm trying to keep it cheap for an experiment so I went with a 2-way using a 5 1/2" Silver Flute Driver mated with a 1 1/8" Dayton Silk Dome tweeter. I've got the cabinets cut to size but lack of funds has brought the project to a screeching halt. I want to build a killer sub sometime but I need someone to sell it to first since I already have a bitchen' sub.

*** End OT ***

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 6:47AM 
Offline
Major
User avatar

Joined: Thu 09-04-2003 2:17PM
Posts: 392

Source: VPN
PM sent

what about laptop speakers off e-bay?


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 10:10AM 
Offline
Captain
User avatar

Joined: Wed 10-23-2002 10:40AM
Posts: 178

Source: Fidelity
if you are 100% intent on doing this I would suggest using this for an amplifier
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdet ... er=320-212
You can probably use the +12 volt rail on your PSU provided that you have sufficient power (amp draws 2A).

For speakers I would use these cheap ass speakers
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl ... er=269-808

I'm still baffled as to why you want speakers built into the case.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 10:15AM 
Offline
Major General
User avatar

Joined: Sat 10-18-2003 10:26PM
Posts: 2954
Location: Stone's throw from Garden of the Gods, Colorado Springs

Source: Christian Campus House
That's a sweet little project amp.

Where and how do you find this stuff? (partsexpress.com, sure, but...)

P.S. Kudos on the 92-cent 4x6's.

_________________
It's still UMR to me, dammit.


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 11:23AM 
Offline
Major
User avatar

Joined: Thu 09-04-2003 2:17PM
Posts: 392

Source: VPN
DLMKA wrote:
if you are 100% intent on doing this I would suggest using this for an amplifier
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdet ... er=320-212
You can probably use the +12 volt rail on your PSU provided that you have sufficient power (amp draws 2A).

For speakers I would use these cheap ass speakers
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl ... er=269-808

I'm still baffled as to why you want speakers built into the case.


thx i'll try that stuff out


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 12:36PM 
Offline
Captain
User avatar

Joined: Wed 10-23-2002 10:40AM
Posts: 178

Source: Fidelity
Quote:
Where and how do you find this stuff? (partsexpress.com, sure, but...)


I ordered a PE catalog to look at stuff to make audiophile grade interconnect cables and speaker parts. They have tons misc stuff that would be fun to play with. I saw that little amp in there and figured it would probably work alright for something like this project. Another place to find speaker parts is http://www.madisound.com If you do a google search for "gainclone" there are shitloads of inexpensive DIY chip amps that apparently sound amazingly well considering the price. http://www.diyaudio.com is another good place to look at DIY audio gear with lots of very knowlegeable people on their forums.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed 07-14-2004 7:08PM 
Offline
Major General
User avatar

Joined: Sat 10-18-2003 10:26PM
Posts: 2954
Location: Stone's throw from Garden of the Gods, Colorado Springs

Source: Christian Campus House
I don't know whether to thank you or curse you.

(I'm glad I know where to get some of this stuff now--just, I can see quite a little bit of my hard-earned money going bye bye very soon.)

But, I guess since it's for cool stuff...

Thanks!

_________________
It's still UMR to me, dammit.


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu 07-15-2004 6:37AM 
Offline
Captain
User avatar

Joined: Wed 10-23-2002 10:40AM
Posts: 178

Source: Fidelity
Mop, Try these on for size http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdet ... sf=04d-028
shielded extended range driver. Frequency response from 75-15,000 Hz. Quite a bit smaller than the 4X6's. Obviously these are not optimal but most music falls within this frequency band.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu 07-15-2004 6:46AM 
Offline
Major
User avatar

Joined: Thu 09-04-2003 2:17PM
Posts: 392

Source: VPN
DLMKA,

i'd still have to buy that little amp right? can i power it from my PSU?


Top
 Profile  
    
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu 07-15-2004 1:10PM 
Offline
Captain
User avatar

Joined: Wed 10-23-2002 10:40AM
Posts: 178

Source: Fidelity
You'd still need the amplifier and possibly their pre-amp. I don't know anything about that amp. If you do order those speakers give me a holler, I think I might buy 32 of them to put them in a big open baffle line array with a 8" midbass woofer and 2 tweeters to fill in the frequency response. If you put 4 drivers in a series-parallel array and 4 of those arrrays in series-parallel configuration you can maintain the nominal impedance of the driver (hence the need for 32 drivers). I've heard that you can get really sweet sound out of cheap drivers like this for minimal cost.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile E-mail  
    
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group