As a quadling, and a friend of Kip, I thought that was kind of crappy. I'm not sure what prompted such a display, but I humbly disagree. Kip's a good guy and a good RD. I'm glad he's around. I'm not sure what went on with the pies in the face and whatnot, but I don't think it was worth that kind of a stunt.

My two cents.

Furb

I don't make trouble, I just advertise it.

I deal with Kip on a semi-regular basis and I'd have to agree with 2NW.

-Ryan

as one of the 2nw hooligans, i am frightened that anyone could stand up for that man...our floor had a wonderful holiday theme for the this year. "A welfare holiday"...it didn't even put down any of the major religions like some others we thought of...so here we were with all sorts of items duct taped to our hall walls, construction barrels, shopping carts, microwaves, plastic army men...all in festive holiday decor with tinsel and lights (pictures of the whole story can be seen at boxe2nw shenaniganschristmas decorations in the tj projects ) the whole thing lasted almost a week before we were forcefully told to remove our decorations...a few days before the contest...our r.a. got bitched at, because kip thought the things were distasteful and unacceptable...we had spent almost 40+ man hours on that project with all of the tweaking and finetuning we were doing toward the end before we got shut down...but wait, there's more...after we were taking down all of our stuff, i put up signs expressing our displeasure in kip's decision, asking for us to be given a chance, but those too were taken down within the hour of posting...so now our hall is decorated in a crappy display of lights, just like everyone elses, because that is the more socially acceptable form of holiday joy...this was a terrible decision on his part, harshly shutting down the creativity that we are trying to foster here... btw, we tried to say "kip is a facist" but the letters got too small

dapin
"I may disapprove of what you say, but I will fight to the death your right to say it." -Voltaire

It may not have put down any of the major religions, but it sounds like its targetting a specific group of people in a negative way.

I can imagine its very appreciated that you did not go all the way and 'put down' any of the major relgions, however.

I know Kip as well, and would have to agree with Furbe here that he is not an ass. He is looking out for the best interests of all the people here living in the dorms, and your 'welfare christmas' could be poking fun at a few people here. While you might find it very humorous, it could be opening a wound further for others. Your arguments of creativity do not apply here. Yes, its not your typical holiday thematic idea, but its hardly creative. Oh boy, you put christmas decorations on chairs and not the normal holiday tree. WEEEEE.

You are living at the whim of the people in charge of these facilities. As has been brought up numerous times befone on these message boards, if you have a problem with the way things are managed in your dorm, move out. Kip is in charge, and that is something you just have to deal with.

And Ryan, moving the picture has been greatly appreciated. Thanks. :)

-quamosity

Well, I'm suprised I didn't get flamed worse than I did...

I wasn't trying to accuse you of making trouble Ryan, I just felt the need to express my disagreement. I also talk to Kip on a semi-regular basis, as he lives across the common from me, and I like Kip.

I'm sure I would've been pissed as well if someone had cost me so much effort, but I think you're well aware of the reasons for removing a display of that nature. The trouble you saw was inconsequential compared to the things that could've been done and said to Kip had he not taken action. I mean, while creative, A Welfare Christmas wouldn't have been very pleasing to the administration of this school, and to the public at large, and it's Kip's job to make sure that both of those have a positive image of the residence halls. I'm sorry you guys put so much work into it only to have it shut down, that sucks. But unless you weren't being ironic in your post at all, I think you knew this would be a controversial decoration scheme, and I would also say you knew what would happen if you hung up signs like the ones you hung.

Again, I'm sorry for your loss of effort. However, unless you really are blatantly and happily clueless of what will and will not be acceptable, then I think you knew this would cause trouble. Turns out it did, suprise suprise. I read "--{The Story}--". Clever, but blown out of focus. Making you take down stolen items is hardly Nazi or Facist. At least "--{The Story}--" possessed more eloquence than the signs.

All I can say is, I'm sure you expected this to happen, and I'm sure you're glad for a chance to bitch and complain about something else that's wrong with your UMR experience.

BUT. All that aside, my focus wasn't to debate your freedom of expression in Christmas decor, it was to say I disagreed, because in my dealings with Kip, I've not found him to be an ass, a facist, or a Nazi. I think he's a good RD. So that's that. And, by the way, I like lights. 4n's pong is kickass. Has 8s done anything cool this year? I haven't heard.


Furb.

"...so we took the half-a ton of garbage, put it in the back of a red VW Microbus, took shovels and rakes and implements of destruction, and headed on toward the city dump."
--Alice's Restaurant, Arlo Guthrie

Whoever made us take our duct tape christmas display is an ass. There was nothing about it that was offensive in any way. As far as I've been enlightened, it was Kip. Our halls were not blocked for fire access, and the reasoning behind the removal was 'fire safety'. Even in the most blocked part 3/4 of the hall was open for walking through. There is nobody on campus that is too fat to fit through it, and if there was, that person couldn't even have come through the door from the stairs or even exited through the fire exit anyway. Even our RA helped us put the stuff up, and hes a pretty by-the-book guy.

Therefore we concluded and advertised:

Kip is an ass

and were forced to remove it after just about everyone, including RA's from all over the world, laughed....

since when does laughing guarantee approval?

Their reasonings for 'fire safety' are sound as well. Hell, throw out everything else and base this argument on fire safety and you have nothing. The items taped to the walls provide fuel for a fire and prevent smooth exit from your floor.

Lets imagine, for a moment, that someone on your floor didnt put out their cigarette from the a few hours ago, or there is one too many items plugged into the wall and a spark set some papers on fire. Quickly, the fire would spread. It might be contained in the room it originated in, but since we lack the very best in ventilation systems, the smoke would have to pour into the hallway. Eventually, the fire alarm would go off, awaking all of you slowly, who exit your rooms and discover a smokey hallway. Those with headphones on playing CS better hope your doors are unlocked or your roommate wakes up so you too can get out safely.

So you all have to make your way down the hall. Thing is, someone thought that it would be a funny christmas idea to attach large items to the wall. With all this smoke, its already hard to make it safely down the hall, and now its multiplied a few times. Coughing and wheezing while you make your way down the hall, you unfortunately smack your head on that upside down chair. That blasted chair leg puts a gash in your head, and you immediately start bleeding. Lets hope you don't fall unconscious before you make it to the fire exit....or at least have someone there who can help you out...or wants to help you out.

But hell, let us assume the worst and that there is NOONE there to help you. You cough and wheeze your last goodbyes and pray that the fire gets put out.

But it doesn't.

You die.

Your parents later sue the school for failing to protect you from situations like this. They might win, but that is not going to make you come back alive.

If only they had a person like Kip to help prevent you from dying.

* * *

Is this a little too paranoid?
Probably, but that doesn't mean it couldn't happen. And thats why we have these 'silly' fire safety rules. And if you parents are as stupid as you are, then we have this 'silly' fire safety rules to prevent you from killing yourself and your parents getting paid for your silliness.

Welcome to America

He's an ass for all the things he did previous to the 2NW thing. That is why the sign was funny. I only changed the link because there's some flaming queers that cry whenever someone gets made fun of and try to get this site in trouble.

quamosity: everything is a fire hazard. All christmas lights, plastic santas, etc are flammable. Large metal things taped to walls are not flammable, and duct tape isn't exactly a highly flammable item either. If we lived in your world of no fire hazards, we wouldn't have any christmas fun at all. In fact, we wouldn't have a miriad of things: cars, houses, people (people are flammable too!! did you know this??). So as far as things taped to walls goes, there was no reason to have them removed. They were metal things, and non-flammable, except for 1 plastic barrel that was confiscated by the UMR Gestapo, and thus it was no longer there to burn. Christmas lights generate heat and are plastic, I suppose these should all be taken down too?

Get a grip, its christmas, people aren't dying, and people also aren't enjoying themselves due to Kip.

First off, the only thing in the hall that could have been considered in the least a fire hazard was the shopping cart, which could easily have fit 3 normal sized people next to it in the hall, or 2 fattys. In a fire exit situation this wouldn't have presented a problem. For someone to have hit their head on a chair, or anything else, would have required them to be about 3 to 4 feet tall. Sorry to break your hopes of death and destruction, but we don't have any midgets or children living on the floor. In addition, the cart was near the center of the floor, so to reach the nearest exit would have meant no more than 3 or 4 people having to walk by it, all of whom knew quite well the cart was there.
I admit that there were strong grounds for removing the stop sign and construction barrel, but the rest of it there was no good reason for. It was not meant to offend anybody, and wasn't put up to offend anybody. It was a random, creative idea that over half of the people living in the hall joined in to make a reality.
The taking down of the items we spent so much time to put up upset me, but did warrant the window sign. What made me spend hours making the letters for the sign rather than study for my Monday final was the fact that he removed the signs complaining about the incident and told us we were not allowed to put signs up about the incident. That statement, and the general violation of free speech and self-expression that went along with it, were what prompted the sign, as well as the words "Nazi" and "Fascist" being used in the descriptions of the incident.
Everyone is free to not like the sign or the fact that we put it up. If you don't want to see it, don't look at it. Nobody is forcing you. If you think it's too hard to avoid looking at the sign because you live in TJ, then I offer you the same advice people seem so intent upon giving those of us who put the sign up: Move out. The argument is just as valid for me giving that advice as it is for me being given that advice. I value my freedoms, and am willing to fight to keep them. Kip trying to take them away is what brought this on.

First off, Kip sucks. Second, the decorations were as about as big of a fire hazard as walls or doors, yet you morons still have those. We chose to decorate our hall the way we wanted to. It did not offend anyone! For those of you who are complaining about the decorations, do you have some for your room or house? If so, you better call the fire department ahead of time. Oh no, flamming shopping carts everywhere! Help.

Get a life these decorations were our little world of fun, if you didn't like them, FUCK OFF.

I guess when you are in charge of the dorms here on UMR, you can establish your freedom of speech laws and what not. But seeing that you are living here under the terms of the university of missouri rolla, you just have to live with the nazi facism you are discovering.

Face it, you don't have any freedom, so you cant go spouting off this BS about having it.

Psygon: You apparently failed to read into my argument like Darknight did.
However, fill your hall with smoke, turn out the lights, and then try to make your way down the hall. Add terror to the equation, and then try getting out safely. Maybe its a worst-case scenario, but its still a risk that needs to be prevented.

Consider Kip your landlord. His rules (through the university) go. Thats just the way it is. If you dont like his rules, find another place to live.

So, to sum up:

-Obstructions protruding from the walls in a hallway are fire hazards. While they may not be flammable, they do present a risk upon exiting the floor in an emergency.

-Kip (through the university) is your landlord. His rules go, and you must follow such rules (even if they GASP take away your 'constitutional freedoms')

-Stealing = bad. OMFG HE TOOK AWAY OUR STOLEN STUFF OMG BASTARDS!@#!@#$%

Seeing that this has nothing to do with your subject matter, thats no longer important--while it may be offensive, its not longer an issue. Tis a shame I suppose.

-quamosity

Oh, and btw, I finished my finals today, and I will be around all week. Should this need to be continued, I will be here with all the fucking time in the world. : ) Bye bye now

I know you are right that we are, unfortunately, at the mercy of the Res-Life people, but I feel it necessary to point out that this school is state-owned, and therefore the law does apply here. Of course that doesn't mean jack to the administration, or res-life, as they seem to not particularly care about the law (ie. building code and TJ South) but still if someone actually went to the trouble of starting a long drawn out court battle the school would be in the wrong.
I realize my argument is quite flawed about the stealing. I say since state property (the construction barrel) was moved from denny's parking lot back onto state property nothing was actually stolen, just relocated. But that's just a joke.
Also, I would like to point out, you aren't the only one here who is finished with finals who will be around all week. However, being a veteran to having overblown arguments closed, you should know that there's no way Ryan will let this discussion go on all week. To let this continue much longer would be rediculous.

Gotta agree with Quamo on this one. What you all fail to realize is that everything you GET to do in the dorms is a privledge, not a right. They don't have to let you put up Christmas decorations in the halls. They try to be accomodating and make your stay pleasant, but in the end, you are BORROWNING space from the University. While you might like to think you're on some righteous crusade against facism and tyranny, in all reality you're just a pissy tennant who can't understand his rental contract. Go buy a house. All of you. 2N should just go together and buy a house and then you guys can hang whatever the hell you want on the walls. I mean, I've said it before, but if you find the residence halls so abrasive, move out, change schools, be proactive instead of bitching about things you can't change. This isn't a democracy where every person comes together to decide what's right and wrong. Kip does the job he was hired to do, that is enforce university policy in the Residence Halls, and do his best to make it a pleasant place to live for EVERYONE, not just for 2N. You might say he's an ass, but it's mostly because you're closed minded and angry because your toys got taken away. I mean, move on. You tried a stunt, it failed. Calling Kip an ass for doing exactly what he's supposed to do is just moronic.

Furb.

"It's the dark hado...."
--Ryu, Street Fighter Alpha The Movie

I know, i just like to remind myself :-p